iOwnTheWorld.com

Marijuana use is bad. It is a gateway drug, studies show that it can cause or elicit depression and other mental illnesses at the time of use or years later, and it causes anti-motivational syndrome. It is damaging to the developing adolescent brain. Legalizing marijuana will only cause the drug cartels and dealers to provide some other which will be even more destructive and addictive. At least a drunk can be productive when they are not under the influence. Plus, if we protected our borders, we would not have so many people (KIDS) using marijuana. Dealers target kids. Dealers should rot in jail.

I love the smell of Good reefer. Too bad I can’t smoke it. Makes me stupid and lazy. But legalization is a toughie for me. It (pot)does have its good points. It definately is no worse than alcohol if used moderately. But it does have the potential to mess up some peoples lives. But 99% of those people are the same ones who abuse alcohol now. But, I do know people whose lives are honestly made better by pot. (and not just the dope dealers)

1.) It actually is dangerous, particularly for the young. Kids who smoke it are more likely to wind up with mental illness and depression. Once it’s legal, absolutely no effort will be made to keep it away from kids. None. Zip. Nada. If you think otherwise, you’re completely out of your mind.

2.) If it “mellowed people out,” wouldn’t the ghetto be a perfectly safe place to drive through? Why is it that every single person in maximum security was/is a habitual pot-smoker, and was most likely on the drug at the time of the crime that put him in prison? Pot flips on your “I don’t give a damn” switch. Maybe for you that means sitting on the sofa watching Jerry Springer and eating Cheetos. But for someone else it helps him giggle his way through a rape. I for one would like to see less apathy in society, particularly chemical-induced apathy.

3.) No one is in prison for smoking a joint. Prison? A joint? Wow. Really?

4.) Legality is legitimization. “Legal” puts it squarely within the culture.

5.) Usage will go up.

6.) Once something is supplying tax money, the state has a vested interest in keeping its use steady.

7.) The “legalize it” people will, of course, complain about the taxes, because they f*cking lie about everything. “Tax it” is just a ploy to pull people over to their side.

It is insideous and pernicious.

Works on the Russians when they let in poppies to mellow out the people so much they did not mind being ruled. I would have to smoke a lot of dope to make me thing O’Drama was good.

Why then are libtards so down on booze and smokes?

The denizens of all our cities use dope and alcohol and habitually vote socialist. Hmmmmm.

That gateway argument is BS. If not pot the people who are going to use coke or heroin or whatever would just start out with some other means to alter their state of mind/body. It does however cause some people to be unmotivated, me included. That’s why I don’t smoke it. However I know people who are actually motivated by it. I have a former employee who is Bi-Polar, who was truly helped by smoking pot. And it does alleviate nausea and some pain. I’ve smoked enough dope to fill the room I’m sittin in, and I suffer from serious memory loss which I believe was largely caused by it. But I was an abuser. I believe in moderation, I think it can be a good thing.

RKae – agreed. You said it so much better than I. I hate the fact that some loser, immoral, jerk of an adult somewhere can make money off of peddling drugs to a child and putting that child at risk. It makes me furious. I think drug dealers should have the crap knocked out of them and be sent to some island somewhere.

I believe in moderation, I think it can be a good thing.

I guess that sentence was a point prover about the negative effects on intelligence, huh? LOL

I’m against legalizing it personally. Mainly because I’m military and have seen firsthand what happens when you get hooked. My unit is kicking out two for it right now. Their reaction time has slowed, and their demeanor has become more apathetic. I want people that can pay attention and cover my back when I deploy next year.

As conservatives we must recognize the long history of alcohol use in Western civilization. We as a culture have adapted to and have ways of dealing with it. Pot is a disruptive drug that doesn’t really have a cultural history beyond Native Americans and Cheech and Chong. I am for medicinal uses of Marijuana if they are legitimate, otherwise NO F*CKING way. We really don’t know enough about the abuse and what it does. I am pretty sure I smoked more than everyone on this blog in the 70s and look where it got me eh? Don’t give me any crap that today’s pot is better, when we found good pot in the 70s we knew it since it only took 1-2 hits to get high… Good night!

I like going camping and making my wife think there’s a skunk nearby…

You had to be there.

I just had my 6th back surgery yesterday and pills, even morphine doesn’t help my pain.
I hate to break any laws and gave up drinking over 25 years ago, but would definitely try pot if it were only legal here in Indiana.
I’ve always wondered if anyone else can make an honest opinion concerning what would be worse coming at you the other direction in a car, a person drunk on whiskey or high on pot. My choice would be a person that just finished a joint.
Neither would be good but my pick is a stoner.

Medicinal yes, recreational NO!

Don’t give this damn Federal government one more thing to TAX.

RC yeah I hadn’t thought of taxing the medicinal. So piss on all of it. Keep it illegal. Worked so far for a very long time. Something wrong when the damn Federal government has to have their damn hands in and on everything. Legalize Pot and we’ll have a whole new branch of gubmint to
ru(i)n it. I’m getting to old and too pissed off to stand much more of this.

Okay, I don’t mind people smoking pot, as long as they aren’t doing something important. I did, it’s one of the most enjoyable past times ever. I just couldn’t get much accomplished.

Which is EXACTLY why I do NOT want it legalized here in California. We have a medicinal marijuana law already, it’s working fine. I have never seen anyone denied a medical pot card. But we already have ENOUGH retards here, we do not need everyone else turning into a retard.

California is already useless/non-productive; we want to go the other way. Or so I would think…

PEOPLE SAY THAT MARIJUNA CAUses LEthargy And memory los…zzzzz.

Hey, what’s this thread about again?

Aye Carumba,

I think some people here watched Reefer Madness believing it to be documentary.

My favorite has to be “helps him giggle his way through a rape.”

Please tell me you weren’t serious?

Marijuana has increased incidents of rape? Where? When?
Rape is an adrenaline fueled violent hate crime. I could make the argument that marijuana PREVENTS rape.
If someone is a rapist, and they are capable of rape, “giggling their way through a rape” is probably better than strangling their way through one.
Marijuana does not induce people into rape. That is absolutely ridiculous.

Furthermore, not ONE anti-marijuana argument, that isn’t just simply ill-informed, couldn’t be made about alcohol. That’s the point. Why is one legal and not the other?

We make fun of people all the time for conveniently dropping the term “illegal” from immigration. I love when someone talks about it being legalized, suddenly the proponent is talking about legalizing it “for adolescents.”

Where is that coming from? The same laws would be applied that are applied to alcohol.

As for “gateway” drugs. That is ridiculous. Studies show that most serial killers started by killing animals. That shows bad wiring in the head, not that pulling flies wings is a “gateway” to serial killing. Chicken/egg. Chicken/egg.

It really surprises you that felons smoked pot along the way? I bet they drank beer too. “Beer, the gateway beverage.”
If EVERYONE that ever smoked pot ended up in prison you’d have a point. The vast majority of people who smoke pot are NOT in prison. So, what does that tell you?

Rkae says they want to see a society less chemically apathetic. Okay, that means the legalized “prescription drugs” that millions of people take go bye-bye. Including alcohol.

The marijuana bogeyman is perplexing. It’s being targeted merely because it would be so difficult to tax. It is just way to simple to grow.
So the result is people believing government propaganda like Reefer Madness.

For the record – I don’t smoke pot.

@BFH, isn’t that a bit like saying “We already have Obamacare, we may as well throw in Amnesty?” Alcohol is horrible, but just because it is legal doesn’t mean we just go for the full enchilada.

You’re right, the risk of violence is greatly reduced while smoking pot. But don’t ignore the fact that middle- and high-schoolers DO already drink alcohol; many already smoking pot. Having it legal would DRAMATICALLY increase the chances of it being in their hands.

I found marijuana to be a gateway drug because, much like alcohol, it removed many of my inhibitions. I never wanted to even drink, much less do any drugs at all. I started smoking pot, and soon I started drinking, and then meth within 3 months. It doesn’t happen like that with everyone, but why in the world are we in such a rush to increase those odds?

The argument that we would generate all kinds of revenue is, in my opinion, BS. It would not end the war on drugs, it would only fuel it; you are now in direct competition with the government if you would like to sell. Don’t you think that they would be cracking down on plantations that much more? It would probably cost more in enforcement and regulation than it would generate.

Perhaps I’m wrong, but that is my experience.

More ridiculous arguments.
I’m getting the sense that people think legalization means train conductors with joints hanging out of their mouths, doctors saying “open wide” and using his lighter to look down your throat.

THE SAME LAWS WOULD APPLY TO POT AS ALCOHOL. You can’t drink on the job, can you?
In fact, SMOKING is more restrictive in society than any other activity. What makes you think that pot would be getting a free pass?

And lack of productivity will get you fired whatever the reason. What does pot have to do with that? If you can’t handle the job, whether it be drinking or smoking pot, you’re in trouble.
I’ll tell you right now, if I owned a business and had to choose between the pot smoker and the drinker – POT SMOKER. No question about it.

So far, not one compelling argument has been made against marijuana given the fact that alcohol is legal. Nary a one.

I would never ever want mary jane legal
Why
It pisses off more people on the left than on the right, its that simple.

My personal and non-scientific thoughts on marijuana:

I do not know if it is a gateway drug – the DEA says “yes,” but there are numerous studies that say “no.” Those I know that “graduated” to harder drugs would have probably used Pez candy as a gateway drug if marijuana were not available.

I don’t know if overall long term usage would increase, although I would anticipate a temporary spike in usage if marijuana is legalized. At least in the area where I live, marijuana is already ridiculously easy to get – many high schoolers have told me that marijuana is far easier to get than alcohol.

When I was in undergraduate school, I knew people who had never tried alcohol. However, the number of people I knew who had never tried marijuana was roughly zero, although the vast majority never used it regularly.

If marijuana is legalized, this would probably had an adverse impact on the viability of those drug cartels who specialize in marijuana, although they would exist for other drugs. Bootleggers prospered during Prohibition, and were put out of the alcohol business after repeal. In other words, you will not see an increase, but a decrease in illegal drug cartels; Big Pharma will step in instead.

Combatting drug use is exceptionally expensive for our society, and some argue that the cost of the drug war is far out of proportion to the benefits. Drug cases clog our criminal courts, and we spend billions of dollars on several different agencies with little or no apparent effect.

I believe much of our drug problem is “demand driven” instead of “supply driven.” Our war on drugs is not winnable unless we address the demand side of the issue – suppliers will always exist to supply the demand.

A certain amount of drug abuse is always present in every society, regardless of legality or illegality. I do not know that “zero tolerance” is a realistic or achievable goal.

With regard to availability of marijuana to kids, I believe that this will occur whether or not marijuana is legal or illegal, and ironically, legalizing marijuana may actually make it somewhat more difficult for kids to obtain it. Actually, I see this issue as more of a “parental supervision” problem that a “drug problem,” particularly with younger children, and I don’t think anyone advocates legalizing marijuana for minors.

Like the arguments for Prohibition, which were morally sound, and the resulting debate over whether or not Prohibition was workable, legalization of marijuana is a more difficult issue than it first appears.

isn’t that a bit like saying “We already have Obamacare, we may as well throw in Amnesty?”>

No, not at all. The argument is more like “we already have Obamacare, we can’t have Obamacare.”

Not legalizing marijuana is like not legalizing the new alcoholic beverage I just invented called Smoke in a bottle.

With all due respect, the availability of drugs does not make an addict.
Don’t come at me with the “guns don’t kill people, people kill people” argument and expect me not to fire back that drugs don’t make an addict, people become addicts.

You’re making a liberal argument when you say the availability of drugs caused “my addiction.”

Sorry. That doesn’t cut it.

Moderate pot smoking is the same as moderate drinking.

You consume to the level you want to achieve.

One drink or two drinks = buzz.
You can smoke whatever gets you buzzed.

A six pack and a few shots gets you obliterated.
Smoke until you’re baked. Same thing.

Marijuana benefits?
No vomiting, no hangover, no passing out, less expensive and you never danced in the road with a road flare in your ass singing a song that no one could figure out what it was you were saying.

“With all due respect, the availability of drugs does not make an addict.”

And with all due respect, I do not know of one addict who did not have drugs available. Please do not kaganize drugs.

I’ve never known a soul who’s been pulled over for driving under the influence of marijana.

And with all due respect, I do not know one person who murdered someone with a gun who did not have a gun available to them.

Now, am I saying we should outlaw guns? NO. Not at all.

Outlaw murderers.

Same as outlawing whatever it is you did because the “availability” of marijuana “made” you do something bad.

I don’t buy that the availability of something FORCES people to make bad choices.

Reefer Madness wasn’t a documentary? I guess I should have been more sober when I saw it.

I really don’t want to join this arguement, but here it goes.

I think this comes down to personal responsibility. For years I spent a big chunk of my life wishing to die. Not a good place to be in life. But I found a way out of it, on my own (and the love of my husband). If someone chooses to abuse themselves in any form, they will. It doesn’t matter if it’s legal or taxed. It’s not the government’s job to parent us or to take away our personal responsibility for ourselves. These things transcend laws.

Hear, hear! The sound CONSERVATIVE argument! -bfh

And with all due respect, I am being most consistent with my views and how they fit in to conservative values.
I don’t think most of you are really thinking about the arguments you’re making,
especially with the availability of alcohol and prescription drugs always looming to undermine all of your arguments.
Alcohol is responsible for untold death and violence in the U.S, including its association with domestic abuse, and marijuana is the bogeyman. Preposterous.

You do that better than Foster Brooks!

Which always bothered me, BTW.

Oh, the beloved Foster Brooks! Gone are the days where we can enjoy the homespun entertainment of a drunkard.
But Cheech and Chong? They belong in prison.

@Quaint Tarah: No fair interjecting common sense into this argument.

I know I’ve posted this many times before about how I would use it in Viet Nam on a patient waiting for a medivac from the bush with severe trauma. In times where I couldn’t administer morphine because if the patient went into shock on the helicopter ride in and wasn’t under direct medical supervision, he would die of respiratory arrest. But with the help of a good joint, it would at least take their mind off of the extreme pain even for a little while. I’ve seen it first hand.

As far as medicinal use the THC I believe has merit. I know it can help with nausea due to chemo therapy and since it can’t be swallowed for treatment of that then I say smoke it, if it is indicated.

For the other ailments I say make it legal as a suppository….It’s not as much fun to get high if you have to STICK IT UP YOUR ASS!!!

Sounds like we should bring back prohibition, no?

I object to the picking and choosing of legal intoxicants.

A judge retiring to chambers to have a brandy while contemplating the sentence of a kid arrested for pot possession is just a little too Bizarro World for me.

Oh and yes pot or booze and cigs are fine with me, but nothing stronger in the drug line. I’d rather deal with a pot head then a drunk, but never someone on PCP or crack on up.

Let’s just say they both are destructive to productivity.

So the question still is,
why is one legal and the other not?

“Gateway drug” is ridiculous. Alcohol is every bit the gateway as pot.

We are discussing pot versus alcohol, agreed.

I think there are some assumptions in the comments that are patently false. Legalization would only be for adults. And doing anything dangerous while impaired, driving or otherwise, would be illegal. From what I have read about legalized pot in other countries regular use would not rise much, increase in recreational use wouldn’t be very detrimental, and it sure wouldn’t cause anywhere near the deaths and misery that alcohol currently does.

Alright, my turn…

First Pot used to be legal, or to put it another way, wasn’t illegal. I don’t know if there were more or less rapes, robberies, muggings or what because no one thought to find out if they were high when they committed other crimes. The crime was enough, they went to jail for the criminal act not for being high.

Second, Pot, hemp, Mary Jane, blah blah blah.. same same same, so to make one illigal while trying to legalize the other is silly.

My information that may or may not be correct, is that Hemp (the knarley stem part of the pot plant) was used for making Rope (thus “smoking rope”). On or around the 1930’s the DOW chemical company invented a new wonder fiber called “NYLON”. Nylon had only one big flaw… It was expensive, but the chem giant, knew they could make it cheaper if they got a Govt. contract.

Enter the US Navy, purchaser of fine rope in many sizes and calibers. In order to get the Navy contract Dow had to remove the competition, so lobby Congress get the offending Hemp illigalized because of a moderate “drug’ problem, and the rest is history.

Billions spent to incarcerate Drug pushers, dealers, users… a drug cartel making hundreds of millions of dollars, and nearer and dearer to MY heart, Sailors having to deal with a more dangerous enviroment.

Hemp ropes hum or whistle prior to parting under strain, and they give you lots of time to see it coming, they then start parting and unraveling at a resonably slow-ish pace. Nylon shirnks from a three inch hawser to about a half inch, storing energy the whole time, until it parts usualy with a loud bang and a hunk of rope flying backward into the deckcrew at gunshot speed.

So that’s my take no one ever said Pot was a great thing, but in the final analysis it’s called ‘weed’ for a reason, it grows everywhere. Let it be smoke it if you want, or like me keep it out of your life. Your choice don’t let someone (Govt.) choose for you.

I can’t see a teen driver smoking weed and driving. Or an adult running machinery with joint hanging off his lips>>>

Who is saying that these activities and circumstances you’re describing would be legal?
They wouldn’t be.

Yeah, I was serious. My point: The ol’ myth that it makes people less violent is utter bullsh*t. Rapists, thieves and you-name-the-criminal smoke pot all the damned time, and it’s never mellowed out a single one.

Yet, that’s a myth I hear CONSTANTLY.>

They DRINK all the damned time too. Criminals seem to be substance abusers. Go figure. You’re confusing cause and effect.
Question: Have you ever smoked pot? Have you ever drank alcohol?

@Chalupa

Well I’m sure you’ve heard that when Jesus did that, the wine didn’t have time to ferment; therefore, it had no alcohol in it. That’s speculation on the part of my brethren in the faith; however, personally I go fifty-fifty on the chance of it being booze. There’s nothing wrong with drinking, especially wine or beer, but there’s reference in the scripture that strong drink, e.g. Jack Daniels, is Devil’s brew and is to be avoided. Something like that. Cheers.

RKae,

What did the cartels sell before illegalization?

The point I’m trying to make, and not offend anyone (failly miserably, I’m sure), is that Pot hasn’t allways been illegal. Once upon a time it was just a weed.

Pot or alcohol? Oh, alcohol is the worse drug! I was a bartender for years and grew up around addicts of many kinds. No question that alcohol alters ones perception and personality more than marijuana. It’s also the gateway drug. I, personally, would never have smoked a cigarette or a joint if I hadn’t been drinking at the time I tried them. And marijuana never made anyone I know want to go out and get some other kind of drug. Not even alcohol. Mary Jane sure has been demonized. This cartoon is right on! SO are you, bfh!

However, if a judge was sipping a scotch in chambers deciding upon my sentence I would feel more comfortable than if I knew she was hitting a bong. It’s just a gut thing…..>

Not if they were contemplating your pot possession charge.

For what it is worth:

Marijuana was classified as a Schedule 1 drug by Congress in the Controlled Substances Act in 1970 under President Nixon. A Schedule 1 drug is deemed to have no societal acceptable use (including for medicinal purposes), and this has caused a considerable amount of conflict with those states who have authorized marijuana for medicinal purposes.

The hemp plant has many uses other than for consumption. In addition to rope, the weed can be used for cloth, paper and numerous other uses – in fact, I’m surprised the Greenies haven’t pushed for the commercial use of this plant as more environmentally friendly than other things such as trees – hemp is a weed and grows like a weed.

Somewhere, I have a hat made out of hemp. The hat is not particularly remarkable except for the warning tag that says “Do Not Consume This Product.”

@Jayne

Now, now, let’s calm down. You hurt BFH’s feelings and he’s gonna shut the whole damn site down. And I, being Jor-El, father of Superman, would be most upset and would come to earth and destroy the entire internet, so that NOBODY can play. Hmph!

You are a dumb shithead Fur! >>>

Jayne, you ignorant slut. heh

But what makes pot equivilent to alcohol, yet disqualifies it from equivocation to cocaine or heroin?>>

Cocaine is HIGHLY addictive, as is heroin.
Cocaine and heroin can kill you (and interestingly, so can alcohol. Kids die of alcohol overdose, never heard of a pot overdose.)if you overdose.

Heroin incapacitates you, and makes you sick once you’re addicted and can’t get any. That DEFINITELY leads to crime because addicts become absolutely desperate not to get sick. They will sell their bodies or worse.
The heroin lifestyle also leads to disease; HIV, hepatitis, staff infections, dysentery.
Cocaine can cause heart attack and stroke, is highly addictive and can cause aggression and rage that is associated with adrenaline crimes.

It’s apples and oranges, really. If pot was dangerous they’d have ambulances and riot control around every Dead and Phish concert.
It just simply does not lead to any of the things associated with harder drugs.
Drunks are more violent. Drunks kill people and themselves. Drunks are a friggin nuisance.
Every party I ever threw that was ruined was ruined by the drunks, not the pot smokers.

@BFH – pot is psychologically addictive – I had to quit cold turkey – it wasn’t easy – I’m glad I did – I was going nowhere in slow motion.

Maybe it’s one of those things that really depends on the individual. Chalupa’s statement is one to consider. In my life, I’ve experience case histories of sorts: a few people that do/did some occasional pot smoking but prefer booze, one person smoked it day and night, but managed his life quite well, went to work, raised kids, pretty good about it. None of them robbing grocery stores for hash.

Here’s the answer, make it legal, and if it ends up reckless maniacs roaming the streets, choking dogs and eating raw meat right in supermarket, then the gov can repeal it. What the heck, the world’s gone nuts anyway. Maybe it’ll help.

This thread is going to Pot.

Let’s look at something really fundamental here. Do you own yourself? If not, is it that you are owned by someone else or some other group of people? Or, if not, is there something about us as human beings that is un-ownable?

The only thing that makes sense to me is that I do in fact own myself. As sole proprietor, I claim as a matter of right to do what I choose with my property. I understand that some of the things I might do are self-destructive; those are called vices. The effect of self-destructive behavior on myself is my business, and forceful efforts to prevent it are simply violations of my property rights.

Saying that smoking marijuana is bad for you is simply irrelevant. Virtually any action you undertake can, if things go wrong, be bad for you.

I highly recommend the best treatise on this general matter, Lysander Spooner’s essay Vices Are Not Crimes: A Vindication of Moral Liberty. You can read it online here:
http://lysanderspooner.org/node/46

Damaging myself by ingesting harmful substances is a vice, and not a crime. I violate no one else’s rights by so doing. Using the force of govt and law to prevent such vice is morally improper, especially if you regard govt’s job as simply to secure our rights.

Dissuading those engaged in vice is a job for religion, not govt. Unless, of course, you are at heart a progressive.

If pot was legalized thousands of non-violent pot heads could be released from prison, our court system wouldn’t be so clogged, LEOs could concern themselves with real criminal activity.